L'Inde

[adelnaili]

le su30 coûte 40 millions ??? :O :O :O

[2020]

le su30 coûte 40 millions ??? :O :O :O

"des ensembles technologiques pour la construction sous licence de 42 chasseurs SU-30MKI."

ce ne sont pas des avions clé en main ! certainement sans maintenance, ni armement ;)

[Darkjmfr]

Et sans la phase montage. Pas sûr non plus que les Russes fournissent les éléments d’avionique Européens et Israéliens qu'ils utilisent.

Les indiens évaluent le coût d'acquisition de leurs MKI aux environs de 100M$/unité.

[Arka_Voltchek]

A ce niveau, un rafale devient bon marché  :lol:

[zx]

un article sur le kaveri

http://www.aviationweek.com/Blogs.aspx?plckBlogId=Blog:27ec4a53-dcc8-42d0-bd3a-01329aef79a7&plckPostId=Blog%3a27ec4a53-dcc8-42d0-bd3a-01329aef79a7Post%3a50586a4b-8bdc-4d26-868a-8f15572b3f80

[FATac]

Tiens, en cherchant des informations sur l'upgrade des Jaguar, dans la presse anglophone, je suis tombé sur plein d'autres informations sur tout un tas de projets de l'IAF.

Certains points ont déjà été abordés ici, d'autre pas (ou je n'ai y pas fait attention).

Voici une petite synthèse de ces informations.

[box title=Jaguar]La mise à jour des jaguar va durer jusqu'en 2022-2023, en incluant le program DARIN III (Display Attack Ranging Inertial Navigation). Ce programme comprend une nouvelle suite avionique comprenant un Glass Cockpit et un nouveau pilote automatique. L'appareil pourra tirer des munitions guidées de précision. Le changement des commandes pour du Fly by Wire est toujours incertain.

Cette mise à jour comprendra la remotorisation des Jaguar. A ce propos, l'IAF a émis une RFP (Request For Proposal) directement auprès de Honeywell Aerospace pour cet aspect. Cette RFP demande la fourniture de 270 turbo-réacteurs F125IN pour équiper 125 appareils (plus un volant de dépannage).[/box]

[box title=Ravitailleurs]L'appel d'offre en cours verra le choix probable du A330 MRTT, plutôt que du IL-78MK.

C'est un marché de 1 Milliards de $ pour 6 appareils. A l'étude approfondie du dossier, les coûts de maintenance et la consommation de carburant sont moindres pour l'Airbus, alors que le coût 'fly away' par appareil était pourtant en faveur de l'Illiouchine.

Le précédent marché, déjà favorable à l'Airbus en 2006, avait été cassé en 2010 par le Ministère des Finances. L'estimation des coûts avait été jugée "fantaisiste", mais elle est à présent confirmée avec de sérieux gages de rigueur. La décision d'introduire un nouveau type, alors que l'Il-78 était déjà en service dans l'IAF, avait été critiquée et jugée non-pertinente.

La décision concernant l'option pour 6 de plus fera peut être l'objet d'un nouvel appel d'offres ...

Les ravitailleurs en cours d'acquisition seront déployés à Panagarh AFS (Air Force Station), en support des Su-30MKI du commandement oriental.[/box]

[box title=Helicos]Ce marché sur les hélicoptères de transport lourd verra le choix du CH-47, plutôt que du Mi-26.

Si la vente est confirmée, Boeing livrera 15 CH-15F, pour 1 milliard de $.

Le Chinook s'est avéré l'offre la moins chère, à la surprise générale.[/box]

[box title=FGPA]Fifth Generation Fighter Aircraft, dérivé du Sukhoi T-50 PAK-FA, et co-développé par Sukhoï et HAL.

La coopération bute sur la répartition des tâches et le partage du développement. Initialement, les plans prévoyaient un premier lot venant de Russie en 2017. La demande de participation accrue des indiens au développement repousse cette date à 2020 pour la version indienne. Mais l'Inde espère toujours recevoir ses trois prototypes "Made in Russia" en 2014, 2017 et 2019.

La commande initiale de 200 appareils dont 48 biplaces, risque de se réduire, à 144 mono-places, et un nombre de biplaces en forte réduction.[/box]

[box title=BrahMos]En décembre, l'IAF doit procéder à un tir aérien de test du BrahMos aéroporté.

Ce test aura lieu en Russie, avec un des deux Su-30 MKI spécialement modifiés, à Irkutsk, pour tirer ce missile et mener les essais (mesures, télémétrie, etc.).

Une nouvelle commande de 1,5 Milliards de $ a été passée pour 200 missiles aéroportés supplémentaires (et quelques autres missiles russes non détaillés). Les seuls BrahMos représentent 1,2 Milliards de $.[/box]

[box title=M2000]L'Inde démarche très activement les possesseurs de Mirage 2000 en vue de remplacer ses appareils perdus. Il faut trouver deux biplaces pour remplacer les deux 2000TH perdus. Si les biplaces ne sont pas disponibles, l'Inde est prête à se rabattre sur un, voire deux monoplaces. Des accords semblent près d'être trouvés, mais les pays sources ne sont pas encore publics.

La modernisation est donc toujours prévue pour 51 appareils et comportera un cockpit compatible JVN, un nouveau radar, un nouveau système de navigation et d'attaque, un nouvel IFF, des systèmes de guerre électronique (détecteurs et brouilleurs intégrés), une capacité pour des missiles BVR (MICA).

Les co-contractants sont Thales et HAL pour les équipements, MBDA pour les armements.

Deux appareils (un mono et un bi-place) sont actuellement détachés en France pour le chantier de validation des kits de modernisation.

Le chantier de mise à jour proprement dite aura lieu en Inde au cours des 10 prochaines années.

Les versements concernant ce chantier ont commencé en avril/mai dernier.[/box]

[box title=MMRCA]Ambala AFS (Air Force Station) sera la première base à accueillir le gagnant du MMRCA.

Au total, 6 escadrons seront dotés du Rafale, répartis sur 2 bases du commandement occidental (dont Ambala) et deux bases du commandement oriental (East Air Command).

Les installations à Ambala seront remises à niveau, avec de nouveaux locaux et une réfection de la piste avant l'entrée en service du Rafale en 2017.[/box]

[collectionneur]

Merci de ses mises a jours sur les divers programmes. Ci cela continuent avec les coupes dans les eurofighter, on va finir par voir la RAF se remettre au jaguar made in India.

[zx]

Defence modernization funds cut by Rs 10,000 crore; Army operations may be hit

http://idrw.org/?p=17189#more-17189

The modernization budget of the armed forces has been slashed by around Rs 10,000 crore in a major jolt to them in the New Year. The cut is contrary to defence minister A K Antony’s earlier promise of a hike in the defence budget to cater for the threat of the expansive China-Pakistan military nexus.

The finance ministry conveyed the decision for the Rs 10,000 crore cut in the capital acquisitions for the Army, Navy and IAF to the defence ministry, arguing that fiscal adjustment was necessary since the economic situation was grim, said sources.

The move will lead to a major slowdown in the ongoing acquisition projects—ranging from aircraft and helicopters to howitzers and missiles. It also makes it clear that the already much-delayed $20 billion MMRCA (medium multi-role combat aircraft) project to acquire 126 fighters will not be inked anytime before March 31.

IAF had been assured an additional Rs 10,000 crore to cater for the first instalment of the MMRCA project—under which final commercial negotiations are underway for French Rafale fighters—if inked within this fiscal.

Antony, during a rare discussion on defence preparedness in Parliament in May, himself had declared he would seek a hike in the Rs 1,93,408 crore defence outlay in the 2012-13 budget due to “new ground realities” and the “changing security scenario” in the backdrop of the China-Pakistan nexus.

But, now the armed forces’ hopes have been dashed. As it is, they get much less than what they demand every year. The armed forces, for instance, had sought a defence outlay of Rs 2,39,123 crore this fiscal that would have amounted to 2.35% of the projected GDP for 2012-13, but got only Rs 1,93,408 crore, or 1.9%.

Then, revenue expenditure (day-to-day costs and salaries) in the defence budget continues to far outstrip the capital outlay for new weapons, sensors and platforms. The two stood at Rs 113,829 crore and Rs 79,579 crore, respectively, this fiscal.

“The actual capital acquisitions budget was even less at Rs 67,672 crore. First, the revenue budget (non-salary) was cut. Now, the capital outlay also has been hacked. The forces were on course to spend 67% of the allocated capital outlay by this time. Many projects will be pushed to the next fiscal,” said a source.

While Navy and IAF are better placed, the real worry is the “critical operational hollowness” in the 1.13-million Army. The Army had projected a requirement of over Rs 10 lakh crore for the 12th Plan (2012-17) period to acquire new capabilities and plug huge operational gaps in artillery, aviation, air defence, night-fighting, ATGMs (anti-tank guided missiles) and specialized tank and rifle ammunition.

A crucial project during the 12th Plan is to raise the new mountain strike corps, with two specialized divisions for high-altitude areas, at a cost of well over Rs 60,000 crore. Dedicated for “rapid reaction ground force capability” against China, this corps will have its HQs in Panagarh (West Bengal) and add to the two new infantry divisions already raised at Lekhapani and Missamari (Assam).

[FATac]

Juste pour fixer les idées :

Rs 10,000 crore ça fait dans les 2 850 000 000 $ (près de 2 milliards de dollars, ou 1,4 milliards d'euros).

1 crore = 10 000 000 unités.

La roupie indienne est à 100 pour 1,85 $ ou à 100 pour 1,39 €

[Philippe Top-Force]

Juste pour fixer les idées :

Rs 10,000 crore ça fait dans les 2 850 000 000 $ (près de 2 milliards de dollars, ou 1,4 milliards d'euros).

1 crore = 10 000 000 unités.

La roupie indienne est à 100 pour 1,85 $ ou à 100 pour 1,39 €

Ces conversions et les cours de monnaies donnent mal à la tête, après ces fêtes de fin d'années  :lol:

En décembre 2012, Londres a répliqué http://www.lemonde.fr/international/article/2012/12/07/londres-supprime-son-aide-a-l-inde_1801716_3210.html

[zx]

ca commence à se tendre, va falloir tenir jusqu'à la signature. le MOD confirme que c'est HAL qui assemblera les 108 avions.

M-MRCA project: Govt firm on HAL as lead integrator, turns down Dassault Aviation's plea to play a bigger role

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/politics-and-nation/m-mrca-project-govt-firm-on-hal-as-lead-integrator-turns-down-dassault-aviations-plea-to-play-a-bigger-role/articleshow/17875655.cms

NEW DELHI: The Defence Ministry has decided to remain firm on having HAL as the lead integrator for producing 108 multirole combat aircraft in the country, virtually turning down French firm Dassault Aviation's plea to play a bigger role in the multi-billion dollar project.

The Ministry's stand in this regard has come after French firm Dassault, which has bagged the IAF deal for supplying 126 M-MRCA, asked it to define the role of Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd (HAL) in the project.

As per the tender, first 18 of the 126 aircraft are to be supplied by Rafale from its facilities and the rest 108 are to be license produced and integrated by the HAL at its facilities here.

If any company other than HAL is designated as the integrator, it would be deviation from the tender issued for the project and as per the Defence Procurement Procedure, it will have to be approved by the Defence Acquisition Council, Defence Ministry sources said.

In view of this, the Ministry has decided that it will stick to the clauses of the tender issued in 2007, they said.

The Ministry is expected to convey its decision on the issue to the company during the negotiations on the deal beginning next week.

The French company had told the Ministry that if it is given the overall responsibility for the project, it should be given the freedom to decide on the proportion of work to be done by HAL and private companies in the programme

If the Government had given a major role to the French firm in producing the aircraft in the country, it would have assigned a major share of work to an Indian defence company.

Soon after Dassault was declared as the lowest bidder for the MMRCA (Medium Multi-Role Combat Aircraft) deal piping EAD's Eurofighter, it signed a MoU with a Reliance Industries Ltd.BSE 1.51 % company for working together in the security sector.

[Henri K.]

L'Inde serait en train de rejeter SNECMA? Si c'est le cas, est ce que le contrat de MMRCA sera touché?

http://www.business-standard.com/india/news/defencemin-goes-global-in-search-for-kaveri-partner/497740/

DefenceMin goes global in search for Kaveri partner

The process for selecting a partner that has these technologies is underway

Ajai Shukla / Bangalore Jan 04, 2013, 00:43 IST

The Ministry of Defence (MoD) will no longer ask French aircraft engine builder Snecma to help it in resurrecting the indigenous Kaveri jet engine, which has reached a dead end in development.

Instead, major global aero engine manufacturers will compete in a global tender to partner the Gas Turbine Research Establishment (GTRE) — the Bangalore-based DRDO engine laboratory — in refining the Kaveri engine to the level where it can power the Advanced Medium Combat Aircraft (AMCA), an indigenous, fifth-generation fighter that is on the MoD’s long-term horizon.

“We are abandoning the plan for co-development with Snecma. We still need an overseas partner. But it will not be Snecma on a single-vendor basis. We will select our partner through competitive bidding,” says Dr CP Ramnarayanan, director, GTRE.

Business Standard, on a visit to GTRE in Bangalore, was briefed that the Kaveri still delivered significantly less power than what a modern fighter requires. In flight-testing last year at the Gromov Flight Research Institute (GFRI) in Russia, the Kaveri’s maximum thrust (termed “wet thrust") was measured at 70.4 KiloNewtons (KN). High-performance fighters like the Tejas or the AMCA need engines that generate at least 90 KN of thrust.

“To develop a more powerful Kaveri engine quickly and to become self-reliant in engine design, we need a foreign partner which can bring in core technologies. Otherwise the next cycle of engine development could take another 15-20 years,” admits Ramnarayan, frankly.

Developing a jet engine for a high-performance fighter was technologically more demanding than any other aircraft system. Only a handful of countries have been able to develop aircraft engines; China, like India, has not yet achieved success. The DRDO is struggling to develop the nickel and cobalt superalloys for the Kaveri turbine, where temperatures of 1,600 degrees centigrade warp normal metals.

Shaping the alloys into engine parts is an equal challenge. GTRE has learned how to make “directionally solidified” turbine blades; but it has not mastered the making of “single-crystal blades”, which are now standard.

The process for selecting a partner that has these technologies is under way. A DRDO committee is identifying specifications for the engine. Based on these, a Request for Proposals (RfP) will be issued to engine makers.

Meanwhile, as already reported by Business Standard (“Kaveri engine to fly futuristic unmanned aircraft”, December 26, 2012), GTRE is developing a spin-off Kaveri engine that will propel India’s first unmanned bomber, termed the Unmanned Strike Air Vehicle (USAV). The Kaveri’s current “dry thrust” of 50 KN will suffice for the USAV.

The refined Kaveri engine that will come out of the foreign collaboration will be used for the futuristic AMCA, but not for the Tejas fighters of the Indian Air Force (IAF), which will be powered by American engines. The first 40 Tejas Mark I are being built with the General Electric F-404IN engine, while the subsequent Tejas Mark II would have the more powerful GE F-414 engine.

“We were planning to re-engine first 40 Tejas fighters with the Kaveri. But now they will continue to fly with the F-404 engine,” says the GTRE director. DRDO has moved a paper to the MoD that strongly backs the Kaveri programme as the foundation of aero engine development in the country. The DRDO calculates that India’s aerospace requirements over the coming decade will include jet engines worth Rs 1,60,000 crore.

Major aero-engine development facilities are being set up in Chitradurga, where a 5,600-acre hub of strategic industry will house R&D, testing and production units of the DRDO, Department of Space (DoS) and Department of Atomic Energy (DAE).

These will include an official altitude test facility for aero engines, which US defence major Boeing is providing as an offset in India’s Rs 22,800 crore ($4.12 billion) purchase of ten C-17 Globemaster III transport aircraft. So far, GTRE has had to do all its testing in Russia.

Il faut vraiment que les Indiens arrivent au bout de ce programme KAVERI, c'est crucial s'ils veulent disposer d'une capacité autonome de développement des moteurs plus tard. La performance de ce moteur pourrait même être pourrie, mais au moins ils auront terminé le cycle complet d'un programme de moteur.

http://www.business-standard.com/india/news/kaveri-engine-to-fly-futuristic-unmanned-aircraft/496801/

Kaveri engine to fly futuristic unmanned aircraft

Ajai Shukla / Bangalore Dec 26, 2012, 00:22 IST

The Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO)’s faltering project to develop an indigenous jet engine has sparked to life again. With the Kaveri engine, born from this project, found short on power for the Tejas Light Combat Aircraft (LCA), the ministry of defence (MoD) has nominated the Kaveri to power the hush-hush Unmanned Strike Air Vehicle (USAV), a pilot-less bomber aircraft that the DRDO is developing.

The veil of secrecy surrounding the USAV project was thrown off on December 10, when the defence minister told Parliament that, “(the) Kaveri spin-off engine can be used as a propulsion system for (the) Indian Unmanned Strike Air Vehicle.”

Already drones, or unmanned air vehicles (UAVs), are changing the nature of air power with their ability to strike targets without endangering pilots lives. USAVs are bigger, 8-10 tonne drones, akin to strike fighters in their ability to carry heavy weaponry including bombs, rockets and missiles. Since they are piloted by remote control, they can be built lighter, stealthier, and sent on even the most risky missions.

The Indian USAV project is a lease of life for the Kaveri engine. Although India will import jet engines worth Rs 1,60,000 crore over the next decade (DRDO projections) none of these can be used for the USAV. The Missile Technology Control Regime (MTCR) prohibits its 34 signatories — including every major engine manufacturing country — from selling engines for unmanned systems with ranges of over 300 kilometres.

An Indian jet engine, therefore, must power the USAV and the Kaveri is the only option. Although underpowered for fast-moving fighter aircraft, the DRDO believes the Kaveri is well suited for the USAV, which is lighter, flies slower and manoeuvres less sharply.

Business Standard visited the Gas Turbine Research Establishment (GTRE), the DRDO laboratory that is developing the Kaveri engine. It reached a key landmark last year, when a prototype Kaveri was flight-tested in Russia at the Gromov Flight Research Institute (GFRI). The engine’s performance was measured on a “flying test-bed”, a four-engine IL-76 transport aircraft that had one of its original engines replaced with a Kaveri.

During this test the Kaveri did well, generating 49.2 KiloNewtons (KN) of “dry thrust”, marginally less than its target of 51 KN. But there was a serious shortfall in “wet thrust”; the Kaveri generated just 70.4 KN, well short of the targeted 81 KN.

(‘Dry thrust’ refers to the standard output of an engine in routine flight. ‘Wet thrust’ refers to the enhanced output that is generated when the fighter requires maximum power, eg during take-off or in aerial combat. Termed “lighting the afterburner”, this is achieved by pumping fuel into the engine’s exhaust.)

The Kaveri’s dry thrust is deemed adequate for the USAV, which does not require wet thrust since its survival depends on stealth (invisibility to radar) rather than on speed or manoeuvrability. The Kaveri will propel the USAV with dry thrust alone, eliminating the afterburner.

“Since the USAV will weigh less than 10 tonnes, the Kaveri’s 50 KN will suffice. And, with the afterburner removed, we would significantly reduce the weight of the Kaveri,” says a top DRDO scientist.

GTRE has a threefold plan for perfecting the Kaveri for the USAV. First, it will remove the design flaws that were detecting during testing in Russia in 2010-11; then, after ground testing in Bangalore, the Kaveri will undergo a round of confirmatory tests in Russia; finally, it will be fitted on a Tejas fighter for flight tests.

Meanwhile, the Bangalore-based Aeronautical Development Establishment (ADE), another DRDO laboratory, will develop the USAV. Four years from today, the Kaveri — having proved itself on the Tejas — will be mated with the USAV.

“After extensive ground testing at GTRE, the Kaveri will go back to Russia for flight-testing to ascertain that all the problems have been solved. This is essential for airworthiness certification. Finally, we will test the Kaveri in the single-engine Tejas fighter,” says C P Ramnarayanan, director, GTRE.

The Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA), which oversees the development of the Tejas, confirms that it will provide a Tejas prototype for flying with the Kaveri. It has even nominated an aircraft — the first prototype, numbered PV-1 — which is currently being used for flight-testing new systems.

(The PV-1) was originally built to support the Kaveri engine. While the engine, in its present form, would not suffice for the Tejas, a Kaveri “dry engine” could be used for one of the futuristic unmanned systems,” says P S Subramanyam, director, ADA.

GTRE has asked MoD for Rs 595 crore to develop the Kaveri dry engine for the USAV. This will fund the building of two new Kaveri engines, costing some Rs 50 crore each; and flight testing in Russia, which cost Rs 80 crore in 2010-11 and could cost significantly more now.

“We will take 48 months from the date we get clearance from the government, for completing 50 hours of testing the Kaveri on the Tejas LCA. During the last 12 months, we will actually fly the Tejas with the Kaveri,” says Ramnarayanan.

The defence minister told Parliament this month that the Kaveri project was sanctioned in March 1989 at a cost of Rs 382.8 crore and was to be completed by December 1996. This was revised (in 2005) to December 2009, while the cost was enhanced to Rs 2,839 crore. So far, Rs 1,996 crore has been actually spent on the Kaveri.

Defending the cost escalation, GTRE points out that comparable engines — such as the General Electric F-404 and the Russian Klimov RD-33 — cost the equivalent of Rs 8,000 crore to build in the 1990s, and would cost Rs 12,000-14,000 crore today.

Henri K.

[zx]

Pour Snecma, ce que j'en ai compris, ca serait plutôt la coopération sur le Kaveri, ca fait longtemps qu'ils n'arrivent pas à se mettre d'accord. et cela traîne.  Mais je ne sais pas ce qui cloche, une divergence forte dans l'architecture, snecma proposait une architecture basée sur le M88 core et ils s'y tiennent.  je ne sais pas si DEFA connait ce sujet, si il passe dans le fil.

Les indiens changent régulièrement de pied. ils sont pas prêt de le terminer ce moteur, sans oublier le tejas. D'ici là,  la Chine

aura peut être fini le J20 et le J31  =).

Je ne pense pas que cela concerne le MMRCA.

Autre article, ils n'ont pas appréciés la demande de clarification de Dassault sur le choix du prestataire, je trouvais la demande de Dassault bizarre il y a quelques temps.

Il est clair que l'Inde ne travaille pas au même rythme que l'occident. Ils n'aiment pas être bousculés, mais pas du tout, c'est qu'ils sont susceptibles les bougres.

Mais il y a peut être aussi des problèmes en coulisse, on en saura plus d'ici Avril.

J'ai l'impression que ça s'accroche sur les transferts de techno et les responsabilités de qui fait quoi.

http://newindianexpress.com/nation/article1406939.ece?service=print

[Claudio Lopez]

Euh....

Là, je ne comprend pas trop....

Comment peuvent-ils rejeter SNECMA vus que c'est SNECMA qui produit les M88 ???

Bon, de toute façon, il y a encore des choses à éclaircir...

[clem200]

Ça touche seulement la coopération avec Snecma pour la conception d'un réacteur national.

[Claudio Lopez]

Ça touche seulement la coopération avec Snecma pour la conception d'un réacteur national.

Ha Ok... :|.

[zx]

Europe pips Russia in mega mid-air refueling aircraft deal

http://idrw.org/?p=17230

After having lost out to the US in the race to supply “attack” and “heavy-lift” helicopters to India, Russia has now been upstaged in yet another mega defence deal. India has selected the European Airbus-330 MRTT over the Russian Ilyushin-78 mid-air refuelling aircraft in an Rs 8,500-crore contract.

Defence ministry sources on Thursday said the European Aeronautics Defence and Space Company (EADS) “is now being called for the final commercial negotiations” for acquisition of six Airbus-330 MRTT tankers.

“The actual contract will be inked in the 2013-14 financial year since commercial negotiations with EADS will take some time. Moreover, there has been a massive cut (Rs 10,000 crore) in the defence capital budget for the ongoing fiscal,” said a source.

Both the four-engine IL-78 and the two-engine Airbus-330 had passed the extensive field evaluation trials conducted by IAF but the latter emerged the cheaper option in the subsequent commercial evaluation. “Though the two commercial bids were opened earlier, the final costing last week put the Airbus-330 as the L-1 (lowest bidder) on account of life-cycle costs,” said a source.

IAF, which already operates six IL-78s since 2003-04, is looking to induct the six new tankers or “force-multipliers” from 2017 onwards to further enhance its “strategic reach” capabilities. Only a handful of countries operate such tankers, which with their “booms” can refuel fighters and other aircraft in mid-air to virtually double their radius of operations. IAF’s Sukhoi-30MKI fighters, which have a cruising speed range of 3,200-km, for instance, can strike high-value targets deep inside China with in-flight refuelling.

Despite the recent setbacks with countries like the US, France and Israel muscling into the lucrative Indian market, Russia will remain India’s largest arms supplier for the foreseeable future. As first reported by TOI, the imminent inking of the final design contract for the joint development of the fifth-generation stealth fighter will further buttress Russia’s position. India will eventually end up spending around $35 billion on the project over the next two decades.

This fresh acquisition of the tankers, however, once again underscores the long-winded Indian defence procurement process that often gets derailed mid-way, leading to huge delays in modernization of the armed forces.

Under an earlier 2006 tender for the tankers, IAF had then also selected the Airbus-330 over the IL-78. But the tender was scrapped in early-2010 after the finance ministry ”expressed certain reservations relating to the competitiveness of the bids and the reasonableness of the price”.

The current contract is the result of a fresh tender floated in 2010, where “life-cycle costs” were also made part of the selection process unlike the first one. “Four to five years have been lost. IAF could have got the Airbus-330 MRTT much earlier and at a cheaper cost,” said the source.

The MRTT (multi-role tanker transport), based on the Airbus-330 wide-bodied commercial airliner, can carry 110 tonnes of fuel to “`top-off” several fighters simultaneously through its “aerial refuelling boom system”.

EADS touts its tanker as the fastest one in the business because it can transfer 4,600 litres per minute, greatly reducing the refuelling operation time. The MRTT can also be used as a transport/cargo plane, capable as it is of carrying around 380 passengers or a 45-tonne payload.

[DEFA550]

Je crois comprendre que l'Inde veut qu'on l'aide à construire son nouveau moteur en apportant toutes les technologies stratégiques nécessaires afin de se hisser au niveau des meilleurs et pouvoir se passer d'eux à court terme. Le passage sur les aubes de turbine monocristallines est éloquent ; Ils ne savent pas faire, alors que la SNECMA maîtrise ce sujet.

Je doute qu'un constructeur, quel qu'il soit, brade son avance technologique sur l'autel d'une coopération visant à créer de toute pièce un futur concurrent. A la lecture de l'article il apparaît que la SNECMA a tout simplement refusé d'aller trop loin dans le "partage". Et comme au niveau demandé (1600°C en entrée de turbine) les candidats sont plutôt rares, l'appel d'offre risque fort de faire définitivement capoter le projet.

[xav]

Europe pips Russia in mega mid-air refueling aircraft deal

http://idrw.org/?p=17230

Comme quoi il y a quand meme des bonnes nouvelles.

Malgré la perte de "l'appel d'offre" KC-X, le 330 MRTT deviens un sacré succès international.

En plus, avec KC-Y et KC-Z qui suivront, tout n'est pas perdu pour Airbus Military aux USA

[French Kiss]

Le contrat n'est pas encore signe, prudence avec ce genre de news...

[zx]

http://www.financialexpress.com/news/mmrca-negotiations-run-into-fresh-hurdle/1055029

Vu la réponse du Mod, le rôle de HAL est écrit clairement dans la RFP, je pige pas. je suppose qu'ils l'ont lus, ou alors ils auraient voulus un autre intégrateur.

New Delhi: Negotiations between France’s Dassault Aviation and the Defence Ministry for the $ 10.4 bn (Rs 45,000 crore) Medium Multi-Role Combat Aircraft (MMRCA) tender to acquire 126 fighter aircrafts for the IAF have hit another roadblock.

Highly placed sources told FE, the ministry of defence has turned down Dassault’s assertion that if it is given the overall responsibility of the project, it should be given the freedom to decide on the quantum of work to be shared between Hindustan Aeronatics Limited (HAL) and private companies in the programme. Dassault had made this point in a letter to the Defence Ministry late last year along with a demand that the ministry define HAL’s role in MMRCA.

While rebuffing Dassault’s contention, the ministry has also highlighted that the RfP for the tender issued in 2007 clearly outlines role of HAL as the project’s ‘lead-integrator’ and changes at this stage cannot be permitted.

Soon after Dassault emerged the lowest bidder (L-1) beating its rival Eurofighter on life cycle costs, the French company signed a memorandum of understanding (MoU) with Reliance Industries to work together in Indian defence and security sectors. Industry sources indicated that, “The French company are anxious to start work with Reliance Industries Ltd under the MoU that was inked in 2012 June.”

The latest development adds to a long list of hurdles negotiations have faced since Dassault’s selection as L-1 in January last year.

According to official sources, the negotiations have dragged on for so long also due to issues related to MMRCA’s 50% offsets requirement

[zx]

Chaque fois qu'ils disent, on est confiant, je m'attends toujours à une mauvaise surprise. Dassault considère que les indiens n'ont pas les compétences requises.

http://idrw.org/?p=17276

MMRCA deal: Negotiations between defence ministry, Dassault run into fresh hurdle

Negotiations between France’s Dassault Aviation and the Defence Ministry for the $ 10.4 bn (Rs 45,000 crore) Medium Multi-Role Combat Aircraft (MMRCA) tender to acquire 126 fighter aircrafts for the IAF have hit another roadblock.

Highly placed sources told FE, the ministry of defence has turned down Dassault’s assertion that if it is given the overall responsibility of the project, it should be given the freedom to decide on the quantum of work to be shared between Hindustan Aeronatics Limited (HAL) and private companies in the programme. Dassault had made this point in a letter to the Defence Ministry late last year along with a demand that the ministry define HAL’s role in MMRCA.

While rebuffing Dassault’s contention, the ministry has also highlighted that the RfP for the tender issued in 2007 clearly outlines role of HAL as the project’s ‘lead-integrator’ and changes at this stage cannot be permitted.

Soon after Dassault emerged the lowest bidder (L-1) beating its rival Eurofighter on life cycle costs, the French company signed a memorandum of understanding (MoU) with Reliance Industries to work together in Indian defence and security sectors. Industry sources indicated that, “The French company are anxious to start work with Reliance Industries Ltd under the MoU that was inked in 2012 June.”

The latest development adds to a long list of hurdles negotiations have faced since Dassault’s selection as L-1 in January last year.

According to official sources, the negotiations have dragged on for so long also due to issues related to MMRCA’s 50% offsets requirement and transfer of technology. The French, it appears, are unwilling to transfer cutting edge technology such as that of the electronically scanned AESA radar while citing lack of maturity of the Indian defence industry to absorb such critical technologies as an excuse.

There is a strong lobby of small and medium French enterprises which is against industrial offsets and sees it as a threat to the competiveness of the French defence industry. Early last year, Patrick Colas des Francs, chief executive of Coges, the trade show organizer for the Eurosatory land systems exhibition reportedly said, “Offsets are a threat to small and medium-sized companies. This is a real problem.” “Offset deals not only take production work away from French subcontractors and suppliers, but also provide accelerated access to knowledge and skills that allows companies in the client country to compete in world markets,” he said.

Acknowledging that negotiations between the two sides are far from over former chief executive of Dassault Charles Edelstenne had told a French parliamentary hearing last month: “We are in deep talks at the moment. It’s a complicated country, the negotiations are tough, but there is a desire to wrap up on both sides.” “I’m relatively optimistic,” he added.

However, the biggest threat to an early conclusion of negotiations comes from the financial squeeze the defence ministry is currently facing. As reported by FE earlier, the MoD has been unable to secure extra budget for this year. Moreover, the armed forces’ capital acquisitions budget has been cut by Rs. 10,000 crore. This is certainly going to derail any hopes of the IAF to lay its hands on MMRCA anytime in the near future. According to officials, contract signing before second half of 2013 looks highly unlikely.

http://www.financialexpress.com/news/mmrca-negotiations-run-into-fresh-hurdle/1055029/2

[Eise]

ça risque de les froisser même si il ne doit pas avoir tout à fait tord... ça fait un peu je reviens sur ce que j'ai dit aussi.

[prof.566]

Attention aussi aux "official sources" citées dans les journaux indiens...

[zx]

C'est bien sur à prendre avec des pincettes, ca va pas tarder à monter de notre coté, à surveiller coté usinenouvelle, latribune, blog,etc...